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beck wrote:Gosh you really are a ditz. Quote:If Foxconn is so fabulous, then what was the point of the article you posted? Quote:Gates is the exception in that he passes his wealth on to others in several ways, including the fact that he pays his employees well. Just employing 55,000 people is not enough unless you pay them a living wage. Making billions while employing workers at minimum wage is not the American Dream. http://seattle.cbslocal.com/2012/01/10/hundreds-threaten-suicide-at-microsoft-supplier-plant-in-china/Get it dingbat? He isnt the exception, he is doing the same as Steve Jobs did...maximizing shareholder value. Gates is the largest single holder of shares of MSFT btw. And he (or Microsoft, anyway) pays his employees well...unlike some other rich CEOs. That's my main point.
Hitchens’ Razor: What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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http://www.last.fm/music/James+McMurtry/_/We+Can%27t+Make+It+Here
"When you walk through the door of opportunity, you do not slam it behind you. You reach back and help others succeed." ~Michelle Obama, Septemebr 04, 2012~
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Read this.A very wise (and wiseass) clown basically summed up this very article on this board a few years ago.
If you're easily offended, then you're easily manipulated.
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beck wrote:Gosh you really are a ditz. Quote:If Foxconn is so fabulous, then what was the point of the article you posted? Quote:Gates is the exception in that he passes his wealth on to others in several ways, including the fact that he pays his employees well. Just employing 55,000 people is not enough unless you pay them a living wage. Making billions while employing workers at minimum wage is not the American Dream. http://seattle.cbslocal.com/2012/01/10/hundreds-threaten-suicide-at-microsoft-supplier-plant-in-china/Get it dingbat? He isnt the exception, he is doing the same as Steve Jobs did...maximizing shareholder value. Gates is the largest single holder of shares of MSFT btw. Your problem is that when you spew hate, you aren't necessarily looking at the big picture. That's why you often end up spewing all over yourself. When are you going to learn to get out of your own way?
Hitchens’ Razor: What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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TosaGuy wrote:Read this.A very wise (and wiseass) clown basically summed up this very article on this board a few years ago. Robotics?
Hitchens’ Razor: What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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Possibly. Where I used to work we had quite a few robotic cells. If you have a high production long term job it's cheaper to buy a couple of robots over the long term than to hire people. Without the robots we would not have been competitive in our pricing. when the job runs out now you have a robot for the next job already paid for except for the programming and fixturing.
The dickens you say.
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Nancy wrote:TosaGuy wrote:Read this.A very wise (and wiseass) clown basically summed up this very article on this board a few years ago. Robotics? you aren't necessarily looking at the big picture
If you're easily offended, then you're easily manipulated.
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TosaGuy wrote:Nancy wrote:TosaGuy wrote:Read this.A very wise (and wiseass) clown basically summed up this very article on this board a few years ago. Robotics? you aren't necessarily looking at the big picture I thought that was a good article. Some of the comments were interesting. A lot of the comments refer to Germany doing manufacturing the best way. It might be the best way to get cheap labor from somewhat skilled employees, but it isn't right to tell children that they are best suited for unskilled work when they are still children. The decision as to your "track" in life shouldn't be made in fifth grade, nor should adults be "stuck" in the same type of work because that was what was decided when they were 10. Quite un-American. I agree 100% with the conclusion. "To solve all the problems that keep people from acquiring skills would require tackling the toughest issues our country faces: a broken educational system, teen pregnancy, drug use, racial discrimination, a fractured political culture." We aren't on track to solve any of these problems with our fractured political system.
Don't outsmart your common sense.
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TosaGuy wrote:Nancy wrote:TosaGuy wrote:Read this.A very wise (and wiseass) clown basically summed up this very article on this board a few years ago. Robotics? you aren't necessarily looking at the big picture How did Crusty sum it all up?
Hitchens’ Razor: What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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Zorro wrote:Zorro is disturbed that Zorro has missed this thread. Zorro tells you that the solution is simple. What would Zorro do! Zorro would steal from the rich and give to the poor!Zorro tells this Ozzie the solution is obvious. The Unicyclist has lost some respect for the great Zorro. The Unicyclist is against involuntary wealth transfers.
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Nancy wrote:..... Just employing 55,000 people is not enough unless you pay them a living wage. Making billions while employing workers at minimum wage is not the American Dream. It's a nightmare and it's exploitation. ....
This talk about living wages is just blather. As an employer, I would not pay a person a dime more than they're worth. Being in business doesn't mean you run a charity. Paying people more than they are worth is giving alms. Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
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The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap.
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rubber wrote:The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap. The reason why folks like Unicycle and I broke out on our own is not to be nice guys and employ people. Employees are a pain in the ass for the most part, we do it to make a profit. If you think it is so easy Mr Rubber, get off of your large rear end and see how much fun it is. The world owes no one a living.
”Republicans…we work hard so you don’t have to”.
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Well then, get rid of all yor people and see how much you can make on your own.
The dickens you say.
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rubber wrote:The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap. I was watching a news show about "insourcing" - bringing jobs back to America. The CEO of a company that was bringing jobs back cited the reason as having to pay more in wages to the Chinese workers. In the beginning he was paying them 54 cents per hour. It's risen to $3.00 per hour. That wage is projected to go up to $5.00 per hour in the next two years. He said when he factors in the wage increase, the cost of shipping his product back to the USA, the inefficiency of Chinese workers (American workers are 3-4 times more efficient due to their basic education), and the lack of regulations in China it made monetary sense to insource versus outsource. One person asked him how can that make sense since you have to pay American workers so much more. His answer was that he hires three Chinese employees for every one American.
Don't outsmart your common sense.
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beck wrote:rubber wrote:The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap. The reason why folks like Unicycle and I broke out on our own is not to be nice guys and employ people. Employees are a pain in the ass for the most part, we do it to make a profit. If you think it is so easy Mr Rubber, get off of your large rear end and see how much fun it is. The world owes no one a living. Just for clarification - I don't take the same view about employees as Beck. In the business I'm in, they do a helluva job and are part of the equation in our ability to make money. As the company succeeds, so do all of the employees.
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rubber wrote:The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap. The curious thing to me is how there can be such high unemployment and yet so many businesses that I'm familiar with all have as their number one problem, finding quality help. So the paradox is there is a labor shortage at the same time there is high unemployment.
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The Unicyclist wrote:rubber wrote:The Unicyclist wrote: Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business.
Your argument works in a non-Global economy but this is 2012. Or it just drives business to countries where folks can people for what they're worth. Dirt. Heck, make the kids work too... they're cheap. The curious thing to me is how there can be such high unemployment and yet so many businesses that I'm familiar with all have as their number one problem, finding quality help. So the paradox is there is a labor shortage at the same time there is high unemployment. My husband's company is in dire need of truck drivers. Apparently there is a HUGE shortage of good truck drivers.
Don't outsmart your common sense.
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The Unicyclist wrote:Nancy wrote:..... Just employing 55,000 people is not enough unless you pay them a living wage. Making billions while employing workers at minimum wage is not the American Dream. It's a nightmare and it's exploitation. ....
This talk about living wages is just blather. As an employer, I would not pay a person a dime more than they're worth. Being in business doesn't mean you run a charity. Paying people more than they are worth is giving alms. Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business. It isn't blather at all. The fact that you characterize paying people for their work as "charity" and "alms" says it all. If you're profiting from their labor, you need to pay them enough to live on. If you can't run your business without shortchanging your employees, then your business is a failure.
Hitchens’ Razor: What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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Nancy wrote:The Unicyclist wrote:Nancy wrote:..... Just employing 55,000 people is not enough unless you pay them a living wage. Making billions while employing workers at minimum wage is not the American Dream. It's a nightmare and it's exploitation. ....
This talk about living wages is just blather. As an employer, I would not pay a person a dime more than they're worth. Being in business doesn't mean you run a charity. Paying people more than they are worth is giving alms. Competition in the marketplace drives fat out of companies, or the companies eventually fail. There is no room for alms in a business. It isn't blather at all. The fact that you characterize paying people for their work as "charity" and "alms" says it all. If you're profiting from their labor, you need to pay them enough to live on. If you can't run your business without shortchanging your employees, then your business is a failure. If you care to, I'd ask you to re-read my post. You appear to have misunderstood what I wrote. Responding to some of what you wrote: I disagree with you. I don't need to pay a person enough to live on. I need to pay them what they are worth. If I am doing that, I'm not shortchanging them.
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